PDA

View Full Version : How do you treat the Vendor?



Terry Miller
08-24-2008, 10:03 AM
This is a carry over from another thread. Our companys concept of a vendor or manufacturer is "they grow our business". Without them, we would not exist. Too many contractors get the idea that because they spend money with a company, they deserve all the perks. I know of contractors who get trips, cigars, clothing, you name it. To me, it is all on how we percieve the gift? Is it a way of saying Thank You, or buying time to get you to buy more? I believe the first. The people who own companys give away things to say Thanks. We do it for our customers. If we recieve anything, we Thank the Vendor and continue as before. It does not change our way of doing business or how we treat each other. We were given "The best seats in the house" at a Pro Football HOF game a few years back. Why? We were not the biggest spender or had the fastest growing rate. I believe it was because we delt with them as required. We bought the best products and always paid our bill on time. We treated them as a great supplier and we were willing to dedicate our business to their products. Great products, service and the willingness to work together. A good match. One thing we have always done, is treat the Vendor as we would want to be treated. I take them to lunch and give them gifts. Try it some time and see what happens. Better yet, just tell them you appreciate their service and products. Let us know what happens. Thank You.

John Tornabene
08-24-2008, 10:13 PM
Hey Mike,
Don't take this the wrong way buts lets say your Vendor happens to be a UAMCC member and he/she is making you lots of Money so u speak highly of them and Recommend them which is the best treatment that they can ask for (Agreed)........and now on the other hand lets say that Vendor wasn't good to my business or even me and I'm a fellow UAMCC member..should I be bashing them to other members??

I don't know if I'm making myself clear here but I think that where trying to scrutinize Vendors to much where there may be not much of a benefit to them to even become UAMCC members....... This can go back to that other thread about sponsors.... which is where I'm heading to.

Beth Borrego
08-25-2008, 10:31 AM
We need the vendors, the vendors need us. We are all part of the same industry and have our place. We all deserve to make a living and prosper.

Beth

Roger Gothorp
08-25-2008, 03:54 PM
But just as anyone else in any other arena (vendor or contractor), should an error or something that was done "wrong" in someone's opinion condemn them for life? Can you unequivocably state that you as a contractor have NEVER made a mistake at a customer's property or had a day that you "really" overcharged for because you were faster than expected? Everything has balances. You make a mistake with one customer, you learn and you better serve the next. It's how we all grow as professionals.

Celeste

Jeff LeCours
08-25-2008, 11:39 PM
Advertise and or sponsor, I think we are getting hung up some on the word sponsor

I am a vendor for a couple orgs that have to do with multi unit & commercial properties. I get no special treatment, I am not a voting member of the orgs. I am a VENDOR MEMBER, totally different from their regular members

Now I advertise and sponsor, I wouldn't worry about the actual words, its understood that I am a VENDOR MEMBER, just spell it out in the bylaws and it should be fine.

I pay to advertise in directory, newsletters and magazines for these orgs and then I also sponsor some events, such as local org meetings, small trade shows etc. All sponsor means is I PAY MONEY to the org to be present or have signage at meetings and or events. sometimes I am the only Vendor Sponsor, sometimes there's other Vendor Sponsors, banks, insurance companies are the other Vendor Sponsors usually

What do I get for my money? Exposure to many customers I want to target. I get maybe a couple minutes to speak before the meeting to try to sell myself & company to the org members.

They do usually say that I am a sponsor and that the members should at least give SPONSORS a chance to bid on projects or in the other sponsors cases talk to them about the services and or discounts they offer the Org members

I really think the word Vendor Sponsor , Vendor Members says it all. Don't get so hung up on the darn wording, like I said make it clear in the bylaws the difference is between Contractor Member & Vendor Member and its all good.

Vendor encompasses a lot of fields, not just PW distributors.

Do I think the Uamcc really should be screening, testing, evaluating vendors I just dont think so, a vendor is just a source of money and a way for the vendor to get in front of the contractor orgs Contractor Members. If the vendors have to jump through hoops or may be bashed or denied Vendor Membership for what a bad rating because of a product or two that someone doesn't like, the Uamcc will have very few Vendors and even less money to help run the Org

I don't know if theres a lot of hack Vendors out there, but I am sure there are many very good one, but even the good ones have enemy's and leave it to the contractors to spread the word not the Org. Of course if theres a pattern of abuse, then maybe the org should drop that vendor, but most I dont see a pattern of abuse

I know a real good distributor/supplier company that charges close to double than other companies, I know they charge what they believe they have to charge to stay in biz, I don't bash them, I don't like their pricing 90% of the time on stuff, but you know what 5-10% of the time I save money using them for a certain product or two. I wouldn't want them denied access to the Uamcc Org either. are they ripping people off 90% of the time NO, its their prices plain and simple and 10% of the time you cant beat their price, so I buy what I need off them happily. Others might rank then through the Uamcc contractor review as a rip off supplier and they could be marked throughout the industry wrongly. If I was a vendor hearing some of this I wouldn't bother spending my money on the Uamcc, on the chance I would be marked, IF thats what the org chose to do. I know this is just discussion, but just like I love PWing, I love my PM's I also love some of my suppliers and the ones I dont love or really no about

Tired, time to stop babbling so long

Jeff

John Tornabene
08-25-2008, 11:42 PM
I agree, and nobody hasbeen condemned. I only suggest that if Vendors advertise, it needs to be made very clear that nothing is promised.

I think I keep seeing folks that want to bend ethics or turn blind eyes to bad practices all in the name of gaining membe/sponsor/advertising $$$. All I am saying is that as an Org FOR Contractors, we have to do what's best FOR Contractors and not what is best for a vendor that happened to take us to lunch or promises funds.

Iam not going to get into specifics on this Board but it is time for mis-information to stop getting out because someone gets paid to tout one product over aother or gets paid to only acknowledge one method over another. This hinders progression. If only one method is preached and adopted by a supposed leader (An Org.),then what does that do for the better method that doesn't get mentioned because a Vendor was catered to?

I'm getting a Headache... LOL need a ride on the Harley to feel better.

Hey Mike--I see what your saying and I see a past history on some of this which has you pretty concerned. Fair enough. I don't think that this org should preach any one method. I don't think this org. should preach much of anything except for one thing--HOW YOU WILL BENEFIT IF YOU BECOME A UAMCC MEMBER. This is why I think that Vendors should be allowed to be a Member of the UAMCC. They can also see the light how they can benefit from there membership just like us the contractor can..except by different methods of course which produce the same end result...$$$$$

In this post I see that you state that you are not looking for "Vendors to become members" . So I can understand better since you are on the transition team here.. Do you think Vendors should be allowed to be members and if so why wouldn't you look for Vendors to become members on top of them also spending money to advertise? This is what I'm misunderstanding here in these post with you. I may be looking like a "Whore" for money here but as in my past experiences I see money as being "the problem" but it doesn't mean I ever think that this org. should sell its soul just for the purpose of being profitable.

So where do you stand about Vendors being members...Yey or Nay???

Oh yea Enjoy that Harley they still rule;)

John Tornabene
08-25-2008, 11:48 PM
Advertise and or sponsor, I think we are getting hung up some on the word sponsor

I am a vendor for a couple orgs that have to do with multi unit & commercial properties. I get no special treatment, I am not a voting member of the orgs. I am a VENDOR MEMBER, totally different from their regular members

Now I advertise and sponsor, I wouldn't worry about the actual words, its understood that I am a VENDOR MEMBER, just spell it out in the bylaws and it should be fine.

I pay to advertise in directory, newsletters and magazines for these orgs and then I also sponsor some events, such as local org meetings, small trade shows etc. All sponsor means is I PAY MONEY to the org to be present or have signage at meetings and or events. sometimes I am the only Vendor Sponsor, sometimes there's other Vendor Sponsors, banks, insurance companies are the other Vendor Sponsors usually

What do I get for my money? Exposure to many customers I want to target. I get maybe a couple minutes to speak before the meeting to try to sell myself & company to the org members.

They do usually say that I am a sponsor and that the members should at least give SPONSORS a chance to bid on projects or in the other sponsors cases talk to them about the services and or discounts they offer the Org members

I really think the word Vendor Sponsor , Vendor Members says it all. Don't get so hung up on the darn wording, like I said make it clear in the bylaws the difference is between Contractor Member & Vendor Member and its all good.

Vendor encompasses a lot of fields, not just PW distributors.

Do I think the Uamcc really should be screening, testing, evaluating vendors I just dont think so, a vendor is just a source of money and a way for the vendor to get in front of the contractor orgs Contractor Members. If the vendors have to jump through hoops or may be bashed or denied Vendor Membership for what a bad rating because of a product or two that someone doesn't like, the Uamcc will have very few Vendors and even less money to help run the Org

I don't know if theres a lot of hack Vendors out there, but I am sure there are many very good one, but even the good ones have enemy's and leave it to the contractors to spread the word not the Org. Of course if theres a pattern of abuse, then maybe the org should drop that vendor, but most I dont see a pattern of abuse

I know a real good distributor/supplier company that charges close to double than other companies, I know they charge what they believe they have to charge to stay in biz, I don't bash them, I don't like their pricing 90% of the time on stuff, but you know what 5-10% of the time I save money using them for a certain product or two. I wouldn't want them denied access to the Uamcc Org either. are they ripping people off 90% of the time NO, its their prices plain and simple and 10% of the time you cant beat their price, so I buy what I need off them happily. Others might rank then through the Uamcc contractor review as a rip off supplier and they could be marked throughout the industry wrongly. If I was a vendor hearing some of this I wouldn't bother spending my money on the Uamcc, on the chance I would be marked, IF thats what the org chose to do. I know this is just discussion, but just like I love PWing, I love my PM's I also love some of my suppliers and the ones I dont love or really no about

Tired, time to stop babbling so long

Jeff

Jeff that exactly what I trying to say except that your above post is much clearer then mine are......longer to:D

Beth Borrego
08-27-2008, 08:28 AM
I don't look at them as potential members. But rather potential Advertisers. If they advertise and get a little business but bad word of mouth puts them in a lower sales situation, is it our fault or theirs? I am saying that we should not give praise or endorse soley because they choose to advertise with us. Praise the worthy. If you have a bad experience with a vendor, you as a contractor, should let other Contractors know about it. Especially in an environment of Contractor for Contractor Org.

If they are doing things that aren't in line with helping Contractors, then why should we allow it to go on without question.

Beth states that we all deserve to make a living and prosper. I disagree. If you are running all ove your area tearing up property and just plain giving poor sevice, you'll see sales drop. Same with Vendors... If they drop the Ball, they should see thier bottom line start to dissappear. If tey are able to do anything tey like under some protecton because they will only get praise from membership for fear of losing sponsor $$, then it isn't good for our industry.

I am only proposing that they be treated as only advertisers and not Sponsors. Whe I advertise, I get no guarantees that I will get work. Same for them.. No promises that we'll adapt thier methods or endorse thier tools. If we like something and it has potential to help Contractors, by all means we will scream it from the highest Mountain. In the past and present however, praises are shouted by anyone that gets $$$ for saying so. That isn't helpful to our end customer... The Contractors.

Well, I guess you were a perfect businessman from the start, you wand strokes were perfect, you did everything right with no mistakes. I guess you never were, even once the low bidder and each and every one of your customers chose you with a higher price from day one. Congrats on your success at Utopian living. Please.....we all know that when we are new, we:


are usually too low in price
produce less desirable results
don't know everything we need to know about business


Each of us has a beginning, and an ending. Without vendors we would not be where we are, without us, they would have to deal with homeowners directly, and lets face fact, although education absorbing contractors do take LOTS of a vendors time, often with NO sale as a result, homeowners would take more time. It's a win win for us and the vendors to do business together. I know you disagree, and frankly I'm fine with that.

Now answer this question...how is it different if you refer someone you FAVOR as a vendor to other contractors, as opposed to having them as UAMCC members and letting them network. If it was referrals only it would smack of bias to me. I like certain vendors, as do you, and I guarantee we don't all shop at the same places. I think the CONTRACTOR should decide which vendors best suit their needs. And, I think we all deserve the same respect as contractors, if we are all committed to excellence despite where we price jobs etc. None of us will ever, or should ever have control over another's price. Price fixing - is against the law. (sorry - off on a tangent) And what right do any of us have to wish ill on someone else's bottom line? That's just bad karma - and plain nasty.

Beth

Carlos Gonzales
08-27-2008, 10:08 AM
The UAMCC TT will accompish a common ground on this matter so that Vendors/Manufacturers/Sponsors and Contractors will and can work together together.

In speaking with a vendor yesterday they are interested in hearing more thoughts and as I conveyed to them we are interested in hearing from them again. The conversation above is one-side of the coin...it's just contractors talking. I want and will hear from the vendor/distributor community more on this subject before a position is established with the UAMCC.

Nevertheless, this is good dialogue and I think a necessary step in our "growing pain" stage.

Henry Bockman
08-27-2008, 07:33 PM
The conversation above is just talking. BUT, it's happening on a BBS, in public on a start up orgs communication forum.

Regardless of anyones views some of the comments and views here should not be voiced. I agree with Beth about Karma and most if not all of her post.

The accusatory negative comments being stated in this forum are embarrasing to the UAMCC or any other org. As stated above "This forum is to discuss, plot out, agree and disagree on how the association will co-habitat with distributors and manufactuers in the washing industry."

What it looks like to me is if your not my buddy and agree with everything I say, I hope your company fails and you lose everything. Just the right type of atmosphere to draw in new contractors, vendors and manufacturers.

Anyone see a line for that forming?

Who made anyone the judge of charector and morals or how to run a business here?

Beth Borrego
08-27-2008, 08:07 PM
The conversation above is just talking. BUT, it's happening on a BBS, in public on a start up orgs communication forum.

Regardless of anyones views some of the comments and views here should not be voiced. I agree with Beth about Karma and most if not all of her post.

The accusatory negative comments being stated in this forum are embarrasing to the UAMCC or any other org. As stated above "This forum is to discuss, plot out, agree and disagree on how the association will co-habitat with distributors and manufactuers in the washing industry."

What it looks like to me is if your not my buddy and agree with everything I say, I hope your company fails and you lose everything. Just the right type of atmosphere to draw in new contractors, vendors and manufacturers.

Anyone see a line for that forming?

Who made anyone the judge of charector and morals or how to run a business here?

OMG I just fell out of my chair. We agree! That happens what, once a year?

Seriously, hope all is well with you Henry. Personally, I think that it's important to be fair minded and remember no vendor or contractor is perfect all the time. We should all strive for bettering ourselves every day, and work together. Contractors learn from vendors, in that they see us try things they might not try themselves ( this is good and bad) and they see us test things for uses other than what they are intended for. They listen to our feedback, they try to suggest solutions to problems we face based on what we describe to them. Vendors give out tireless amounts of advice ( I know this firsthand - we used to be vendors years back and decided to stop) and it's not always something that leads to a sale, but still helps to solve the contractor's problem, for no pay on their end. Contractors could not work without vendors, vendors could not survive without contractors who purchase from them.

The UAMCC needs to present the most professional image it can, one that takes into account all of those who call this industry home.

Off my soapbox. It's Henry's fault I posted again. ;)

Beth

Roger Gothorp
08-27-2008, 08:14 PM
Well HOLY CRAP - the UAMCC has just made success history :) Beth & Henry agreed, communicated and no one died!

I think I shall join their club and agree with exactly what both of them said on this topic as well :)

Celeste

Beth Borrego
08-27-2008, 09:19 PM
I don't think the UAMCC should be in a position where they have the right to police any vendor or manufacturer's ads. The link you posted was not aimed at professionals, but at homeowners. It's not the same thing. But even if it were, I would not purchase that machine or operate that way, and I would talk to others, contractors and vendors alike, if I needed to learn to do something I had not done before. I would study, read and research before taking the step of performing a job. I realize not all contractors are like that, and that not all vendors give the same advice. We have some we buy from, some we don't, for reasons that vary. But all of us, both contractor and vendor have a right to do business and to earn a living for ourselves and our employees. Our customers have the right to be either satisfied or dissatisfied with the services they purchase. They have the right to NOT repeat purchase if they are unhappy. That is their business, but I don't see how it becomes our business or our right to act in an exclusionary manner just because someone else's work is not up to your standards or your price levels. If the customer and the contractor are both happy, then it was a good transaction and again, none of anyone else's business. Sorry Michael, but that statement you made in this thread along with a post many of us have read on another bbs (not TGS) has left a bad taste in our mouths.

To me, it's always a better day when I get to focus positive energy on my own business. Focus is a good thing. :)

Beth

Carlos Gonzales
08-27-2008, 11:07 PM
Great post and certainly a touchy subject ~

Here's the deal. The UAMCC has NOT as a group discussed the relationship that the ORG will have with vendors and/or manufacturers.

We will communicate again, as we have planned, to talk with the vendor community to continue our discussions with them. Again if you remember, we have had calls with them in the past. The UAMCC will, after speaking with distributors, will gel a structure/policy around this subject.

As we have in the past, as announcements or important topics come up, we will put them on the UAMCC BBS for continued dialogue.

Michael spoke to me as he did with the other members of the transition team about this topic and we will discuss it more on tomorrows conference call. This is a touchy subject and it was not the UAMCC's intention to put this in the spotlight as it turned out to be until we get our arms wrapped around this.

As the leader of the UAMCC, I apologize to the folks that have read these post and felt that the UAMCC was on a rampage to judge, muscle or finger point at the distributor community. That was not our intent nor is it our position nor has it been our position.

The UAMCC has NOT made it ....yet. We are humbled ...very humbled to have accomplished what we have done thus far but we have many roads to travel. The pace and agenda from Day ONE has been fruitful due to the fact that our promise to the industry has been one of diligence, respect, honesty and empowerment. The UAMCC will and is a contractor driven organization.

The Transition Team will agree with me when I say that being a member on the transition team is a priveldge and with that priveldge comes a enormous amount of responsibilty. But we are also human and unfortunately our human emotion took precedence over of what should have been a productive and positive dialogue. I take full responsibility of this and I can only assure you that we will do everything humanly possible to fulfill our quest in establishing an organization for contractors.

Each member of the transition team has my full support. I did not pick nor will future transition team members be appointed to the team on a "are they liked or disliked" in the industry criteria. For the person that called me up to complain. You will find that you will get more accomplished by focusing in on the problem vs. the person.

Now, some may want to continue to kick this can down the road as a distraction for what we are truly doing here. I hope not but we cannot control the keystrokes.

The run up to establishing a new org is not easy...if it was then it would have been done a long time ago. It is my feeling that the industry has giving the UAMCC a chance to embark in this direction. You as the contractor will and have put a great amount of trust in allowing this to happen for the industry. Again, we at the TT level DO NOT take this trust for granted and we acknowledge that we must still continue to earn your trust as the UAMCC unfolds.

Thank you for your support and your patience!

Jeff LeCours
08-27-2008, 11:25 PM
I understand you Mike, I understand what I and others have said too. I think Mike it comes across as you are anti vendor although I dont really think you are, althou it does sound like you dont trust some which is fine., it comes across that way sometimes and it can all be settled very easily for the Uamcc and this is how
'
There will be Contractor members and there will be Vendor members, doesn't even have to be called Vendor "Members". They can be called vendor supporter, vendor associate members

Contractor members are the Org, they get the say, the vote, the benefits of the org

Vendor Members get a source to advertise their wares to a good target market, they get to help financially support an org, they get no vote they will be aware of that from the beginning, they get no say in the dialog on a Uamcc BBS. If by chance they hear something they dont like, can they voice their opinion sure, by not supporting the org with their membership fees or advertising fees. they don't have to sign up for the next year or have a booth at a Uamcc National Convention what ever

Should the Uamcc go after vendor support YES, its how its done, how to bring in money. I starting a thread about vendor support, because what I read about in a post by Carlos, I started it to be helpful and point out what it said about "the sole support will be by members fee's" That has been taken care of its understood now that Uamcc wants vendor support to help pay for things in the Uamcc


Its two things and the bylaws can handle it simply by a paragraph or two defining that a contractor member has say in a contractors org and a vendor does not get say, they get advertising space in the org and thats it.

If a vendor doesnt like what is put out on ANY BB the most they can do now is go out on the BB and fight and I am cool with that, I dont think the Uamcc has anything to worry about and in that Mike I don't think you have to worry about vendor influence in the Uamcc

Beth Borrego
08-28-2008, 07:32 AM
It's very simple. If you allow vendors and manufacturers to become members (you could for example have different kinds of members) then you have to accept them for who they are and for what they sell. Sorry but it comes off as whining and complaining when you talk about a certain tool being junk and how can they sell it to anyone. (I believe the thread in question talked about ladder savers?) Is anyone familiar with the saying Buyer Beware? I guarantee you that every vendor sells something we don't see value in for ourselves. Again, if the buyer and seller are both happy with the transacion, it was good business. Michael, you do come across as anti vendor, and also as anti newbie (although I know you prefer the words lowballer and hack).You were pretty clear about how you felt in PA.

Carlos, glad you have some checks and balances in place.

Beth

Scott Stone
08-28-2008, 11:49 AM
After a quick scan, I think that many are forgetting that contractors and vendors are really codependent. Nearly every one of us relied on a vendor for counsel and advice on our startup. It probably made those of us that are successful more successful. The vendors rely on us to bring our business to them. They need to sell product for them to meet their obligations. It is a one hand washes the other type of scenario.

I do not think that UAMCC should be endorsing any particular vendor, or contractor, just because they are a sponsor. There are vendors that have stood the test of time, and that I have no problem endorsing. There are others, that I have bought things from based on recommendations, and after receiving whatever product it was, will not use or endorse them in the future. I take my money elsewhere. Neither one, if UAMCC is not having vendor sponsors should be given a leg up on referrals.

Now, would it be smart for contractors to use a vendor sponsor, and give them a chance? Absolutely. You take care of your own. If we don't make them healthy and strong, we cannot be healthy and strong in our business.

Just some of my rambling thoughts.

And I don't know why my email is my user name. I am pretty sure I did not register that way.


Scott Stone

John Tornabene
08-28-2008, 12:27 PM
Yes Yes and Yes to the last 3 post. I will add that I think Beth might have stated above--We the contractors have also taught the Vendors a few tricks and also have helped them learn about some of there products that they're selling or maybe selling after you test it. I've been thru that a a couple of times with Vendors. One Being Sherwin Williams Years ago when I had a problem finding stain that could Penetrate a Mahogany deck(Mahogany decks were not as popular 12-13 yrs ago as they are today here). The product was Super Decking Stain and my use of it was and the satisfaction results was brought up at a Sherwin Williams show with there Vendors. Another time I was the Guinny pig for my local Vendor to test his Stripper that he was making. So I pretty much on those two examples told them what worked and what did not. So we the contractors help the Vendors as much as they help us. Where the guinny pig at times as they are. We need each other!! The best Vendors that I always liked were the ones that were former contractors. Alot of Vendors were never contractors..but that doesn't make them any less qualified to be a Vendor.

I don't think an Org. should Endorse a Vendor because of what the Vendor sells. I do think the Org. should endorse "ALL OF ITS MEMBERS" including Vendors based on there UAMCC membership. If you want anyone from Contractors to Vendors to become a UAMCC member yet the org will not endorse there membership once again does not seem prudent and in the end will cost this org. dearly when it comes to Money. I would not want to spend Thousands of my Hard earned money to an org that will not endorse my company as a UAMCC member.

I think somewhere in here Mike, myself and a few others are getting crossed up on semantics. Bottom line an ORG should always Endorse there members with a disclaimer of course that who ever uses the member that person should due there own due diligence(Of course not to be worded like that).

The Org should Endorse themselves and all of there members...always. The only time that should stop is because of the following--A member does not keep there membership in good standing..or a member is Violating the bylaws.

Also to bad if outsiders see us here debating some of these hot topics. If they want to do something about it then they can............ Bad Publicity is always better then none!!!!!!!!

Jeff LeCours
08-28-2008, 12:56 PM
It's very simple. If you allow vendors and manufacturers to become members (you could for example have different kinds of members) then you have to accept them for who they are and for what they sell. Sorry but it comes off as whining and complaining when you talk about a certain tool being junk and how can they sell it to anyone. (I believe the thread in question talked about ladder savers?) Is anyone familiar with the saying Buyer Beware? I guarantee you that every vendor sells something we don't see value in for ourselves. Again, if the buyer and seller are both happy with the transacion, it was good business. Michael, you do come across as anti vendor, and also as anti newbie (although I know you prefer the words lowballer and hack).You were pretty clear about how you felt in PA.

Carlos, glad you have some checks and balances in place.

Beth

All I have said is different types of memberships settles it all, yes it sounds like Mike is anti vendor, do I really think he is, not really. But anti newbie I dont think he is at all, I know he has offered on more than one occasion to help a new guy

The vendor thing, I see no problem. Hell I know vendors that will sell 2 pounds of Oxalic for what $,8 $9, $10 bucks. Now thats a rip off? But is the vendor a rip off? No I dont think so thats just one pruduct among many products. I can buy 55lbs for $45.00. Vendors package stuff different to make money, just like the ladder saver, so what.

I love PWing
Jeff

Carlos Gonzales
08-28-2008, 01:40 PM
Scott,

I changed your username to read: Scott Stone

Hope that is okay?

Thank you for your contribution to this thread.

Henry Bockman
08-28-2008, 08:21 PM
When I was involved in PWNA we kept it simple. Buy PWNA. We didn't promote any one vendor, we promoted ALL of our contractor, vendor and manufacturer members.

The same thing could and should apply for UAMCC. If your a member of the org you should try to support other members as well. That's one of the great things about Org's, they are great for networking. You don't have to endorse any particular UAMCC vendor or manufacturer member. Just simply say Buy UAMCC to support another fellow member.

Jeff had a point about oxalic acid. Some sell it cheaper than others but that doesn't make the more expensive vendors into crooks. Maybe they haven't found a place they could buy it cheaper for!

When a vendor recommends using one "based" product over another because they believe, have seen, or have been told it works better. Why does that make them a scammer? Could'nt it also be said that they were just making the best reccomendation that they knew of to someone that was asking for help?

Regardless of what anyone thinks vendors want to provide the best support they can for their customers. Why would a vendor ever push to sell something that won't work? It would cost them customers.

Keep It Simple

Buy UAMCC

Carlos Gonzales
08-28-2008, 08:28 PM
Thanks Henry..appreciate the input!

Beth Borrego
08-28-2008, 08:39 PM
When I was involved in PWNA we kept it simple. Buy PWNA. We didn't promote any one vendor, we promoted ALL of our contractor, vendor and manufacturer members.

The same thing could and should apply for UAMCC. If your a member of the org you should try to support other members as well. That's one of the great things about Org's, they are great for networking. You don't have to endorse any particular UAMCC vendor or manufacturer member. Just simply say Buy UAMCC to support another fellow member.

Jeff had a point about oxalic acid. Some sell it cheaper than others but that doesn't make the more expensive vendors into crooks. Maybe they haven't found a place they could buy it cheaper for!

When a vendor recommends using one "based" product over another because they believe, have seen, or have been told it works better. Why does that make them a scammer? Could'nt it also be said that they were just making the best reccomendation that they knew of to someone that was asking for help?

Regardless of what anyone thinks vendors want to provide the best support they can for their customers. Why would a vendor ever push to sell something that won't work? It would cost them customers.

Keep It Simple

Buy UAMCC

Exactly.
And to elaborate that point further, how many of us have been to Home Depot and gotten "help" that really didn't have a clue? Sometimes vendors do hire employees, not all vendors are owner only stores, and the help can be new, and not have all the right answers. If you go around believing everything is a rip off and everyone is out to get you, well, they call that paranoia.

Networking rocks.
Beth

Scott Stone
08-29-2008, 01:48 AM
Scott,

I changed your username to read: Scott Stone

Hope that is okay?

Thank you for your contribution to this thread.


Bless you my son. I was wondering why I could not relog in for a second.

Ken Fenner
09-09-2008, 02:00 PM
Wow, so many excellent points. I knew from day one the vendor issue was going to be on the UAMCC TT's agenda without a simple solution. I do know Michael and I know well his passion. His passion can often be mistrued as being too outspoken or just plain read wrongly in print. I view the former as a positive aspect in a person's personality even though it may not make him or her popular.

It has been mentioned that the relationship between vendor and contractor is codependant. I agree with that and I believe Michael does as well which is why he is stressing the need for honesty and integrity in a vendor. Michael is interjecting his subjective opinion of fair play. I am more in the camp of caveat emptor. The UAMCC cannot judge the merits of a product or service, that is up to the individual contractor.

The UAMCC can never, in my opinion, show partiality to any vendor. If a distributor pays for the space, they can get in front of an audience. If you read Michael's posts he does not have a problem with this type of relationship as long as it is strictly business. As Michael pointed out, if a vendor is pushing a certain product, that vendor should be aware that his/her advertisment could very well appear on an article page or thread that is very contrary to what the advertiser is trying to sell. Any valid vendor will have no problem with that as they learn from mistakes and customer input. They have a right to address contractor issues on this BBS forum like anyone else.

As a compromise perhaps the UAMCC will have a couple of independant contractors that just test products and write impartial reviews? Rick Petry comes to mind as a person that would be awesome at this. If the vendor or manufacturer didn't like the review.. "We are very sorry about that. It may be more in your favor to use your advertising dollars in a different medium." That keeps everyone honest.

Beth Borrego
09-09-2008, 03:22 PM
Ken,
Good to see you and hope all is well! Have missed your posts this summer.
Beth

Ken Fenner
09-09-2008, 05:18 PM
Hiya Beth. Thanks for the well wishes. Had to restructure some things both personally and business wise. Good to see you over here.

Also good to see Scott S. is onboard for the UAMCC movement. I agree he brings an added tone of credibility.

Beth Borrego
09-09-2008, 08:55 PM
Well now that you've sorted out your attic, get back to work! ;)
Beth

Ron Musgraves
02-10-2009, 03:28 AM
http://www.tokbox.com/vm/hq374oyyd20y

Click on the Above LINK!!!!!