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Who Donated any Money in 2008 & 2009????

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Ron Musgraves

Past President
Staff member
I donated Money in 2009.

I know people who Donated in 2008 a few 1000.00

Lets get a calculation of total donations made to the org.

If the president Scott has the itemized records Please post them.

I would like to personally know the itemized totals.

Not trying to make issues or point fingers these are questions members should have.

It really shouldnt take this long to get it, So if you donated please post here and at least we could come up with and idea.
 

John Orr

UAMCC Treasurer
I donated Money in 2009.

I know people who Donated in 2008 a few 1000.00

Lets get a calculation of total donations made to the org.

If the president Scott has the itemized records Please post them.

I would like to personally know the itemized totals.

Not trying to make issues or point fingers these are questions members should have.

It really shouldnt take this long to get it, So if you donated please post here and at least we could come up with and idea.


As Treasurer, I would only have the numbers since January, 2010. I recall personally donating a few dollars ($50?) but I honestly don't recall if it was '08 or '09.
 

Rob Huffman

New member
January 2009.....$1000 (receipt for this says Relief for Washers--does that count?)

October 2009....$600

:frusty:
:frusty:
:frusty:
:frusty:
:frusty:
 

Ron Musgraves

Past President
Staff member
I did and I got every cents worth in headaches Ha Ha Ha Ha


Jeff Truthfully many have speculated on how much you donated. Rumors!!!

Its a personal question and I respect if your not willing to answer.

Thanks for the help Jeff in 2009 , I know your intentions we're good.

Lets All rock in 2010 & 2011
 

John Tornabene

Member Guest
Jeff was probably the biggest donator of the UAMCC as far as I know. I donated $100 to relief for washers,$500 to the UAMCC and then paid for a couple of rooms for others at the Convention which came out to be around another $800. I also split a distributers membership for a year and that was at least another $300. So I was close to the $2000 range. I regret that I didnt match Robert Hinderliters initial offer to donate $1000 in the begining when I said I would as I think Matt Johnson might have said the same.

I have no regrets donating that money except one. I wish I knew where the money went besides the rooms and membership cost for those two others.

I know a few others that donated at least a $1000 each but I'm sure they all wrote it off as a business expense.

Today that to me no longer matters. Its muddy water under a bridge. Lets get this org. moving again. Maybe we can get some others to donate some of there hard earned dollars to get this org. moving. I may donate again because I can see the upside to this org. working when it comes to business. I'd rather invest money here so it can help other contractors like myself as long as I know this time where the money goes.
 

Ron Musgraves

Past President
Staff member
Jeff was probably the biggest donator of the UAMCC as far as I know. I donated $100 to relief for washers,$500 to the UAMCC and then paid for a couple of rooms for others at the Convention which came out to be around another $800. I also split a distributers membership for a year and that was at least another $300. So I was close to the $2000 range. I regret that I didnt match Robert Hinderliters initial offer to donate $1000 in the begining when I said I would as I think Matt Johnson might have said the same.

I have no regrets donating that money except one. I wish I knew where the money went besides the rooms and membership cost for those two others.

I know a few others that donated at least a $1000 each but I'm sure they all wrote it off as a business expense.

Today that to me no longer matters. Its muddy water under a bridge. Lets get this org. moving again. Maybe we can get some others to donate some of there hard earned dollars to get this org. moving. I may donate again because I can see the upside to this org. working when it comes to business. I'd rather invest money here so it can help other contractors like myself as long as I know this time where the money goes.

It matters for the future, tax liabilty is serious.

I know alot of others who did donate past the regular membership fees. Do members know the org is broke and owes money after the transistion.

We all want to say the documents are availiable to the members. How about the 2008 tax returns. The clearly started taking revenue by donations as early as august 2008, by 2009 un-official membership fee's being collected. By end of March the first members 22 if I remember correct signed up at once.

That was 7700.00 at one time. Plus donations. A month later in april roundtable #2 signed 7350.00 in revenue. The pace after that 26.6 members per month at an average of 9333.00 per month. for the next 6 months leading to the convention. Thats just a bit under 55,999 dollars to ad to all the donated funds.

Is was clearly made none of the membership money went to convention fund. 71,049 dollars in total membership from March 2009 to march 2010 plus we are now going to ad donations that I know will total likley another 10,000.

Its not rocket Science if the money didnt get spent on convention then where did it go.

The uamcc should have a clear expense sheet itemized for TAX purpose. These sheets should be balance sheets not summarys.

Providing summary sheets are silly, you can balance a summary from months to month as long as you never show the Final.

John, I think it does matter.

I think the supporters deserve and answer once and for all to put a rest to this.

Its very clear someone has and account of the money. You hired a CPA, the CPA should be able to give these to the oversight committee.

If the oversite committee thats churping right now wants to truly help the org. Find out these questions, if they cannot be answered then just say.
 

John Tornabene

Member Guest
Ron only Carlos knows the answers to this and he's not talking... so I no longer care. Its done. I got mad about it as many others did. The UAMCC doesn't in my guess have the funds to start investigating this. If so then as we discussed in the past the whole org. will just go "Bye Bye".

Carlos aint rich. Yea I'm sure he made some good money at times.... Big deal. Its over as far as I'm concerned. Maybe one day that chapter could be re-opened but today this org. needs to start building again but with a much clearer and much more precise plan and by-laws. The old mistakes can not happen again if they are fixed today. Carlos is yesterdays news. Maybe one day he'll open up and let us all know what happened but for today either way it doesn't solve the current problems. Yes you can say that if Carlos denounces his membership and moves on that some will come back to join....I say don't let Carlos determine on what you want to do with the UAMCC. I am hopeful that Carlos will tell his story to many and be truthful about it all so we can forever close that chapter but I am not waiting for that to happen.

Its time to move on
 

Ken Fenner

Active member
add them all together.. double them.. and they will still not equal what Carlos put of his own money into this org. What is your point with all of this.. other than diversion?

Carlos and George Bush.. yesterday's news. Time to move things forward and stop clinging to blaming past regimes for current day problems.

What guarantees were given to anyone? What promises of ROI were given? I'm not understanding the issue? If you wanted to see tax returns and get receipts, you should never have given the money in the first place. Look in the mirror, point at it and say "there is a person that made a business mistake". Then let yourself off the hook, you had good intentions and you can rest assured your money was spent on org business. If you have deeper issues, file a lawsuit against Carlos.
 

John Tornabene

Member Guest
add them all together.. double them.. and they will still not equal what Carlos put of his own money into this org. What is your point with all of this.. other than diversion?

Carlos and George Bush.. yesterday's news. Time to move things forward and stop clinging to blaming past regimes for current day problems.

What guarantees were given to anyone? What promises of ROI were given? I'm not understanding the issue? If you wanted to see tax returns and get receipts, you should never have given the money in the first place. Look in the mirror, point at it and say "there is a person that made a business mistake". Then let yourself off the hook, you had good intentions and you can rest assured your money was spent on org business. If you have deeper issues, file a lawsuit against Carlos.

What Ken is saying is similiar to what I feel. I have lost alot more money in the Dot.com days then I did here. I don't buy what Ken said about Carlos puting more of his own money in the org then what the membership did and also counting the donations. Carlos most likely pocketed in my guestimation around 30-40 grand. For all the headaches he took and the heartache that went with it my guess is he would not have done any of this. His mistake was he didn't delegate and he also wanted total control. Now he is where he is and he can't like it. Carlos has to deal with this. If he is happy how the org ended up well what can you say. I don't think he is and he will never admit it but he should come clean and say "Yea I screwed up some and I should've listen to the BOD's and I learned from it" but he just won't do that. I hope he proves me wrong. Sometimes its good to be wrong and in this case it sure will.

So take a poll Ron and see what people want to do here. Oh wait the pole thing wasn;t working at least not for me. Once again my guess is that people want to move on. Some have left the org. and some want to give it another go. I say give it another go....
 

Tony Shelton

Environmental Consultant / Past Director
I don't understand why producing records is such a bid deal. Who has them?

Is Carlos claiming they are personal?

Ken, if you were the finance officer for even one day shouldn't you have the records for at least that day?

What happens when guys get audited and have listed the UAMCC as a business donation? Did no one get receipts? If not why not?

This is crazy. I've been audited twice and it's no fun having them question everything.
 

Tony Shelton

Environmental Consultant / Past Director
add them all together.. double them.. and they will still not equal what Carlos put of his own money into this org. What is your point with all of this.. other than diversion? .......

That's twice in a week I've heard the "diversion" claim. Do you guys get together for talking points like the DNC? What is this diversion from?

If you wanted to see tax returns and get receipts, you should never have given the money in the first place. Look in the mirror, point at it and say "there is a person that made a business mistake".

I can't believe the great business guru Ken Fenner has just made that statement. Are you losing it? How many donations to non-profits have you given to without taking the legally available tax writeoff. Maybe this is the diversion your are referring to. It's your diversion.

If you have deeper issues, file a lawsuit against Carlos.

Is Carlos the only one here with blame? How about the Finance officer?

Sound's like a diversion to me.
 

Lonnie Greenwood

New member
It matters for the future, tax liabilty is serious.

I know alot of others who did donate past the regular membership fees. Do members know the org is broke and owes money after the transistion.

We all want to say the documents are availiable to the members. How about the 2008 tax returns. The clearly started taking revenue by donations as early as august 2008, by 2009 un-official membership fee's being collected. By end of March the first members 22 if I remember correct signed up at once.

That was 7700.00 at one time. Plus donations. A month later in april roundtable #2 signed 7350.00 in revenue. The pace after that 26.6 members per month at an average of 9333.00 per month. for the next 6 months leading to the convention. Thats just a bit under 55,999 dollars to ad to all the donated funds.

Is was clearly made none of the membership money went to convention fund. 71,049 dollars in total membership from March 2009 to march 2010 plus we are now going to ad donations that I know will total likley another 10,000.

Its not rocket Science if the money didnt get spent on convention then where did it go.

The uamcc should have a clear expense sheet itemized for TAX purpose. These sheets should be balance sheets not summarys.

Providing summary sheets are silly, you can balance a summary from months to month as long as you never show the Final.

John, I think it does matter.

I think the supporters deserve and answer once and for all to put a rest to this.

Its very clear someone has and account of the money. You hired a CPA, the CPA should be able to give these to the oversight committee.

If the oversite committee thats churping right now wants to truly help the org. Find out these questions, if they cannot be answered then just say.


you just cant leave it a long can you always have to keep the drama going please leave an go some where else you think people dont know what you are doing you are sadly wrong have a great freaking life ron
 

Beth Borrego

New member
Ron,

We have heard all of this for MONTHS. Please stop re-hashing it. You say you are a proponent of the UAMCC and want to see it succeed. If so, let's just keep moving forward. Don't let this be one of those posts that borders on bashing and has to be dealt with via the rules. Thank you.

Beth
 

Ron Musgraves

Past President
Staff member
you just cant leave it a long can you always have to keep the drama going please leave an go some where else you think people dont know what you are doing you are sadly wrong have a great freaking life ron

Please explain what you think I'm doing? Love to hear your version.

Don't the members deserve to know?

I'm just a hard working volunteer who donated my money. You never asked how much I donated?

I deserve like anyone does a right to know why this org is broke when the revenue taken in exceeds the expenses each month.

The Uamcc since jan has not spent 400 or 500 a month if you take out debt thAt was left from last year.

Lonnie your a contractor representing us, no disrespect but please represent.

I'm a customer of this org asking the tough questions, just answer them my freind or get the numbers.

I'm sick and tired of you and others beating around the bush.

Represent your brothers, telling people to leave is not right. I'm socked , you want my help you ask for my money. You even take alll my benifits and now again when I ask you for help you turn away.

Nice
 

Ron Musgraves

Past President
Staff member
Ron,

We have heard all of this for MONTHS. Please stop re-hashing it. You say you are a proponent of the UAMCC and want to see it succeed. If so, let's just keep moving forward. Don't let this be one of those posts that borders on bashing and has to be dealt with via the rules. Thank you.

Beth

This has never been dealt with Beth.

I donated money, it very clear we now know others did as well. Many others donated along with many others.

These new leaders rebuilt and started this org on less money again in the 90 days. They have more money now then when it was turned over.

I busted my azz putting people in this org last year. This is witch hunt , it shouldn't be. It should simply be a we will send you the statements over. Will give you and itemized list or donations. Complete revenue tracking for each month.

Google ads statement, banners revenue, member revenue, distributor revenue & donations all should be listed separate.

No one here or in any other org should be guessing this?

Everyone here was told this org would be transparent.

Let's start today!!
 
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