Jim Chesmore
New member
I have been resi in the past and this year I am branching out to resi-comm (condo, apt, complex). I will become a member of UAMCC after my season picks up.
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As of January 1, 2018 The brand new logo that was created and released in 2017 will be the only official logo in affect and allowed to be used on any electronic media however, any such media like truck wraps, stationary, and postcards will be grandfathered in. Contributing Members will be allowed to use the UAMCC logo in any advertising. Permission to use the logo otherwise must be in writing. Logos used in electronic formats (ie: Websites, forums, etc.) must be linked back to the member’s profile in the UAMCC directory. Contributing Members are members that are paid and current with their dues. Please contact info@uamcc.org with any questions.
Commercial contractors ?? sign in
- Thread starter Jeff LeCours
- Start date
Scott Davis
New member
We are 95% residential (that includes condos and apartments) and 5% commercial. This is 90% roof cleaning, 10% house washing, concrete etc...
I am a member of the UAMCC. Charter member #6!!
I am a member of the UAMCC. Charter member #6!!
Ken Fenner
Active member
I pick up commercial work only when they contact me and agree to my pricing schedule. Commercial accounts for about 5% of what we do.
Resi-com (condos, HOA stuff) is what I am chasing this year and so far have been doing well. I'm expecting 20% of gross to come from it.
UAMCC TT member #1
Resi-com (condos, HOA stuff) is what I am chasing this year and so far have been doing well. I'm expecting 20% of gross to come from it.
UAMCC TT member #1
Michael Kreisle
Contributing Member
Pressure Washing..
99% residential until Commercial starts paying the same margins. Mostly House washes and roofs. No more decks/fences unless for my best customers.
UAMCC Member
BBB Member
Cleaning service...
80% Commercial
20% Residential
Mostly High end retail and Historic Homes. Also Sorority Houses.
99% residential until Commercial starts paying the same margins. Mostly House washes and roofs. No more decks/fences unless for my best customers.
UAMCC Member
BBB Member
Cleaning service...
80% Commercial
20% Residential
Mostly High end retail and Historic Homes. Also Sorority Houses.
Tony Shelton
Environmental Consultant / Past Director
Air Filter & Coil Cleaning
100% Commercial - Subcontracting all residential out. (except one as a favor) (Paying 90% of net just to get out rid of the accounts)
And YES, the profit MARGIN is higher on residential but the HOURLY income is less than 1/4 commercial. It's more beneficial for me to do 20 jobs a day at $300/hr than one job a day at $75/hr. even though my profit MARGIN on the latter is more.
I'm not a member of the UAMCC. I am not a member of N(ational) A(ir) F(ilter) A(ssociation). or any other associations. I've spent thousands on them over the years.
Beginning in 1994 I thought I had to sign on with every association that came along and get certified for this and certified for that, but in the end, as large as the associations were, they offered nothing more than I could get shopping around myself.
The insurance discounts were eventually proved to be bogus.
The supplier discounts were a joke - funny how the discounts always came from the highest priced vendors and even with the discounts you end up paying 20% more than if you just shopped around!
The government representation eventually became limited to whatever benefited the leaders of the orgs and were crafted to eliminate others.
Some Air filter contract TEMPLATES for schools and government bldgs. have been written in a way that completely eliminates anyone but members - and sometimes narrows it down to one supplier via specs - I see them all the time - Ask Scott Stone, he just sent me one! Fortunately this mode of operation is worthless when the local and state governments aren't flush with cash and all those requirements somehow mysteriously find loopholes opening the bids up to everyone else.
(Fill in the blank) has been around for YEARS trying to supposedly "raise the bar" by selling their certification and selling companies on the idea of hiring only their "certified" contractors. In four years of commercial bidding I've only had one company ask me if I was (fill in the blank) certified (I am not) and in the end I got the account anyway. (I used "fill in the blank" because you can almost insert 95% of all organizations into this sentence)
Is that what The UAMCC is trying to accomplish here? Is the intention to get into government regs and strongarm companies into using UAMCC contractors? I hope not.
That's a UNION and it's already in the process of destroying our economy.
If that's not the direction the UAMCC's going how do you plan to offer these exclusive "bennies" (and that is the correct spelling btw) I keep hearing about?
The UAMCC was the first Org I considered joining since 2001, but after posting on here and seeing the cannibalism going on between contractors and the secrecy and protection of paying members instead of gently working them toward a better attitude towards other contractors it appears this is on the same path as most of the others.
The Western US has little or no representation here.
The commercial contractor has little or no representation here.
Maybe it would be beneficial if you concentrated on the base of residential contractors and the East coast. You guys live in a different world from us out West and seem to have fully populated and staffed the UAMCC already. (Carlos is the exception, but Carlos really lives in West Massachusetts. :biggrin
And Jeff can tell you there's no such thing as regular building washes or roof cleaning out here. Jeff is a great example for commercial contractors but his market is a niche that is not nationwide. Dirty concrete, Air Filters and coils and other general pressure washing IS however, nationwide.
The UAMCC may end up being a great resource for the residential contractors and suppliers. If I was washing houses or roofs, I might join.
I would reconsider if there was a genuine change in direction. The concept is a good one. The challenge isn't to make the org. work, anybody could do that. The challenge is to do something RADICALLY different that has not failed the contractor all over the country in other industries.
If you really wanted to "raise the bar" and make the industry more respected wouldn't it make more sense to try to EDUCATE the hackers who are HACKING because they are too broke and too uneducated to rise above that? How can that happen when the membership dues cost more than the pressure washer they are using? Once a hacker becomes educated he will realize that there's a lot more money to be made with equipment that makes the job go faster with better results.
Nothing would make me happier than to be wrong about this. You all know I came over here after the Phoenix RT in full support. People who know me personally know that's the truth.
Lastly, I know words on a screen cannot be read with the same clarity as the spoken word. Before anyone misjudges my words here, I want you to know this was written without any bitterness, sarcasm or disdain. I'm simply spelling out my thoughts on the org and letting you know why I do not intend to join at this time. Additionally I'm throwing out some mistakes in direction made by other orgs for discussion and reflection.
Thanks
Tony
100% Commercial - Subcontracting all residential out. (except one as a favor) (Paying 90% of net just to get out rid of the accounts)
And YES, the profit MARGIN is higher on residential but the HOURLY income is less than 1/4 commercial. It's more beneficial for me to do 20 jobs a day at $300/hr than one job a day at $75/hr. even though my profit MARGIN on the latter is more.
I'm not a member of the UAMCC. I am not a member of N(ational) A(ir) F(ilter) A(ssociation). or any other associations. I've spent thousands on them over the years.
Beginning in 1994 I thought I had to sign on with every association that came along and get certified for this and certified for that, but in the end, as large as the associations were, they offered nothing more than I could get shopping around myself.
The insurance discounts were eventually proved to be bogus.
The supplier discounts were a joke - funny how the discounts always came from the highest priced vendors and even with the discounts you end up paying 20% more than if you just shopped around!
The government representation eventually became limited to whatever benefited the leaders of the orgs and were crafted to eliminate others.
Some Air filter contract TEMPLATES for schools and government bldgs. have been written in a way that completely eliminates anyone but members - and sometimes narrows it down to one supplier via specs - I see them all the time - Ask Scott Stone, he just sent me one! Fortunately this mode of operation is worthless when the local and state governments aren't flush with cash and all those requirements somehow mysteriously find loopholes opening the bids up to everyone else.
(Fill in the blank) has been around for YEARS trying to supposedly "raise the bar" by selling their certification and selling companies on the idea of hiring only their "certified" contractors. In four years of commercial bidding I've only had one company ask me if I was (fill in the blank) certified (I am not) and in the end I got the account anyway. (I used "fill in the blank" because you can almost insert 95% of all organizations into this sentence)
Is that what The UAMCC is trying to accomplish here? Is the intention to get into government regs and strongarm companies into using UAMCC contractors? I hope not.
That's a UNION and it's already in the process of destroying our economy.
If that's not the direction the UAMCC's going how do you plan to offer these exclusive "bennies" (and that is the correct spelling btw) I keep hearing about?
The UAMCC was the first Org I considered joining since 2001, but after posting on here and seeing the cannibalism going on between contractors and the secrecy and protection of paying members instead of gently working them toward a better attitude towards other contractors it appears this is on the same path as most of the others.
The Western US has little or no representation here.
The commercial contractor has little or no representation here.
Maybe it would be beneficial if you concentrated on the base of residential contractors and the East coast. You guys live in a different world from us out West and seem to have fully populated and staffed the UAMCC already. (Carlos is the exception, but Carlos really lives in West Massachusetts. :biggrin
And Jeff can tell you there's no such thing as regular building washes or roof cleaning out here. Jeff is a great example for commercial contractors but his market is a niche that is not nationwide. Dirty concrete, Air Filters and coils and other general pressure washing IS however, nationwide.The UAMCC may end up being a great resource for the residential contractors and suppliers. If I was washing houses or roofs, I might join.
I would reconsider if there was a genuine change in direction. The concept is a good one. The challenge isn't to make the org. work, anybody could do that. The challenge is to do something RADICALLY different that has not failed the contractor all over the country in other industries.
If you really wanted to "raise the bar" and make the industry more respected wouldn't it make more sense to try to EDUCATE the hackers who are HACKING because they are too broke and too uneducated to rise above that? How can that happen when the membership dues cost more than the pressure washer they are using? Once a hacker becomes educated he will realize that there's a lot more money to be made with equipment that makes the job go faster with better results.
Nothing would make me happier than to be wrong about this. You all know I came over here after the Phoenix RT in full support. People who know me personally know that's the truth.
Lastly, I know words on a screen cannot be read with the same clarity as the spoken word. Before anyone misjudges my words here, I want you to know this was written without any bitterness, sarcasm or disdain. I'm simply spelling out my thoughts on the org and letting you know why I do not intend to join at this time. Additionally I'm throwing out some mistakes in direction made by other orgs for discussion and reflection.
Thanks
Tony
Carlos Gonzales
New member
Thanks for the insight Tony. I appreciate it!
Jeff LeCours
New member
Tony I don’t have the time right now to respond to all this or really the stomach for it right now
So you see everything as all wrong. All orgs have failed you. I see it as the UAMCC trying to do something good. Trying to promote our industry and grow an org to help contractors, residential and commercial like some its members now. I'll get back to this later
Never said we would hit the ground perfect, but. I am willing to try to promote this industry I have been doing it for years on the BB's I have shared and helped and learned much from so many. Maybe after you've been around longer than 9 months you will see much of the BS, is just that, BS, hate, agendas, personalities and egos and megalomaniac personalities. We all have egos but it gets crazy on the BB's
Tony there has been some that started attacking from day one, so what, we aren’t suppose to try, because someone thinks it’s a bad idea or they have their own agenda? I hear and see a lot. I have contractors telling me a lot, its sad what has happened behind the scene. I am actually very sick of the venom on these BB’s often now, you know how that is.. Contractors calling contractors telling them why are you on the UAMCC Team, contractors attacking the UAMCC after round tables telling them they shouldn’t have joined or shouldn’t join. I have heard it from some of the very people that were spreading the BS lies that are spoon fed from others. We are used to it on the BB’s, sad to say, you will get used to it if you hang around long enough
I have not misjudged your words I have heard them loud and clear. I and the UAMCC will continue to roll right through the BS and lies and try to do good. Nothing wrong with trying to help and promote my industry is there Tony?
Go UAMCC
Tony I might not get back to this later, I have heard it from you and others and like I said going to keep rolling. Oh ya we have several commercial contractors that think we are off to a good start ones from the BB’s and ones that have never come on this silly internet. Met and talked with several,
So does this mean you arent going to join LOL Have a good weekend
Mathew Johnson
New member
Air Filter & Coil Cleaning
100% Commercial - Subcontracting all residential out. (except one as a favor) (Paying 90% of net just to get out rid of the accounts)
And YES, the profit MARGIN is higher on residential but the HOURLY income is less than 1/4 commercial. It's more beneficial for me to do 20 jobs a day at $300/hr than one job a day at $75/hr. even though my profit MARGIN on the latter is more.
I'm not a member of the UAMCC. I am not a member of N(ational) A(ir) F(ilter) A(ssociation). or any other associations. I've spent thousands on them over the years.
Beginning in 1994 I thought I had to sign on with every association that came along and get certified for this and certified for that, but in the end, as large as the associations were, they offered nothing more than I could get shopping around myself.
The insurance discounts were eventually proved to be bogus.
The supplier discounts were a joke - funny how the discounts always came from the highest priced vendors and even with the discounts you end up paying 20% more than if you just shopped around!
The government representation eventually became limited to whatever benefited the leaders of the orgs and were crafted to eliminate others.
Some Air filter contract TEMPLATES for schools and government bldgs. have been written in a way that completely eliminates anyone but members - and sometimes narrows it down to one supplier via specs - I see them all the time - Ask Scott Stone, he just sent me one! Fortunately this mode of operation is worthless when the local and state governments aren't flush with cash and all those requirements somehow mysteriously find loopholes opening the bids up to everyone else.
(Fill in the blank) has been around for YEARS trying to supposedly "raise the bar" by selling their certification and selling companies on the idea of hiring only their "certified" contractors. In four years of commercial bidding I've only had one company ask me if I was (fill in the blank) certified (I am not) and in the end I got the account anyway. (I used "fill in the blank" because you can almost insert 95% of all organizations into this sentence)
Is that what The UAMCC is trying to accomplish here? Is the intention to get into government regs and strongarm companies into using UAMCC contractors? I hope not.
That's a UNION and it's already in the process of destroying our economy.
If that's not the direction the UAMCC's going how do you plan to offer these exclusive "bennies" (and that is the correct spelling btw) I keep hearing about?
The UAMCC was the first Org I considered joining since 2001, but after posting on here and seeing the cannibalism going on between contractors and the secrecy and protection of paying members instead of gently working them toward a better attitude towards other contractors it appears this is on the same path as most of the others.
The Western US has little or no representation here.
The commercial contractor has little or no representation here.
Maybe it would be beneficial if you concentrated on the base of residential contractors and the East coast. You guys live in a different world from us out West and seem to have fully populated and staffed the UAMCC already. (Carlos is the exception, but Carlos really lives in West Massachusetts. :biggrin
The UAMCC may end up being a great resource for the residential contractors and suppliers. If I was washing houses or roofs, I might join.
I would reconsider if there was a genuine change in direction. The concept is a good one. The challenge isn't to make the org. work, anybody could do that. The challenge is to do something RADICALLY different that has not failed the contractor all over the country in other industries.
If you really wanted to "raise the bar" and make the industry more respected wouldn't it make more sense to try to EDUCATE the hackers who are HACKING because they are too broke and too uneducated to rise above that? How can that happen when the membership dues cost more than the pressure washer they are using? Once a hacker becomes educated he will realize that there's a lot more money to be made with equipment that makes the job go faster with better results.
Nothing would make me happier than to be wrong about this. You all know I came over here after the Phoenix RT in full support. People who know me personally know that's the truth.
Lastly, I know words on a screen cannot be read with the same clarity as the spoken word. Before anyone misjudges my words here, I want you to know this was written without any bitterness, sarcasm or disdain. I'm simply spelling out my thoughts on the org and letting you know why I do not intend to join at this time. Additionally I'm throwing out some mistakes in direction made by other orgs for discussion and reflection.
Thanks
Tony
Thanks for you honest views Tony. It sounds like the UAMCC is not the org for you. It is to bad, you will be missed, you are a smart guy. Orgs arent for everyone. It doesnt make a contractor substandard because they choose not to join for what ever thier reason may be. There are people who will never join an org, even if it was for free.
I have used the logo already in my marketing and is has worked to my advantage. I used it to gain leverage over a competitor on a bid and won the job.
The benefits of the UAMCC may help everyone to a greater or lesser degree. The benefit for me is showing something to my customers that go beyond a quote for simply spraying water on a house. I work for a lot of professional people who belong to thier own organizations of their profession... Doctors, Nurses, Lawyers and such... I think they relate to a parrellel in identity and "small town pressure washing business belonging to a national organization" and I use the Charter Member at every turn.
It is about networking to get a competitive edge in the industry.
Mathew Johnson
New member
Oh I forgot, I didn't mean to hijack the thread with my response to Tony.
We do about a 33/33/33/1 percent split in our Business - 33 percent commercial, 33 percent residential, and 33 percent Wood Restoration. And one percent miscellaneous - We will even power wash you dog if you can get it to stand still and you will write us a check when we are done!
MJ
We do about a 33/33/33/1 percent split in our Business - 33 percent commercial, 33 percent residential, and 33 percent Wood Restoration. And one percent miscellaneous - We will even power wash you dog if you can get it to stand still and you will write us a check when we are done!
MJ
Ken Fenner
Active member
Tony two questions for you.
1) Do you pressure wash?
2) Does anything not thought of by Tony Shelton work for you?
You've been around this industry for what accounts to about five minutes yet you have commentary on everything. I don't care if you are doing fifty million a year in filter cleaning, to the pressure washing industry, you are a noobie. Even if you were born with a wand in your hand, you don't know anybody well enough to make your accusations and poorly supported jabs. If everything doesn't go exactly to the gospel according to Shelton, you get bent out of shape and everyone else is an azzhole in your eyes. Its gettin old.
1) Do you pressure wash?
2) Does anything not thought of by Tony Shelton work for you?
You've been around this industry for what accounts to about five minutes yet you have commentary on everything. I don't care if you are doing fifty million a year in filter cleaning, to the pressure washing industry, you are a noobie. Even if you were born with a wand in your hand, you don't know anybody well enough to make your accusations and poorly supported jabs. If everything doesn't go exactly to the gospel according to Shelton, you get bent out of shape and everyone else is an azzhole in your eyes. Its gettin old.
Matthew Norman
New member
The BBB does just that and all my customers already know who the BBB is.
If I put a uamcc logo on my website and marketing material I don't think even .1% would know who they are.
I'm not completely anti uamcc I just want to see how this year rolls out for others that have gave money.
Mathew Johnson
New member
That is the best attribute... my customers not knowing who or what the UAMCC is. To them, the UAMCC is whatever I tell them it is.
I say this when the UAMCC comes up in conversation with a customer. "The UAMCC is an Org that is a professional network of property cleaning and wood restoration contractors whom resource off one another. It allows me to learn and share the safest ways to clean your property and provide the best results available in the industry."
The customers love it!
Mathew Johnson
New member
Dont hold back Ken, Tell us how you really feel. (LOL) OK.... so maybe he wont be missed.
Jeff LeCours
New member
OK since I started this thread how about we get back to some of the questions I asked. I like to know who does commercial vs resi or both etc etc . Maybe we all can leave the editorials to another post or the back pages of a newspaper, me included
Silly internet
Silly internet
Adrian Carrier
New member
I do both Jeff.
Really pushing the wood more than ever this year as it pays more than some commercial projects.
Really pushing the wood more than ever this year as it pays more than some commercial projects.
Tony Shelton
Environmental Consultant / Past Director
Thanks Ken for making my point. This is exactly what I've been talking about. And from the leadership no less. Priceless.
Jeff, you're taking this too personally. I simply put in writing what I've been telling you for months.
Why does everything have to be "go UAMCC :clap:" to have any value as an opinion? This wasn't an attack on the UAMCC, this was just pointing out flaws in orgs in general. There are SOME things the UAMCC are doing that appear to be going the same direction. If you want the UAMCC to be different from the failed orgs that just end up abusing the contractors then MAKE IT DIFFERENT! I know you can't do that in a day, but at least recognize some of the pitfalls and try to avoid them.
And I don't know where you're hearing all that negative stuff from. I'm not hearing it. I just stated my own opinion. In this area of the country Ron's been trying to tell me to just believe in the benefits and join for months.
I'm just not believing it yet. I don't know anything about anybody giving anyone crap after a RT for joining the UAMCC. It's not coming from out here. There must be something going on in your neck of the woods that I'm not privy to. Is it possible that someone is stirring up trouble by putting a bug in your ear on this? I'm not even sure it's really happening.
Matt, thanks for your response. You made some good points. I've got an increased respect for you now that I know what's involved in putting on a RoundTable. That was the toughest few days of my life.
Carlos, you're trying hard to prove me wrong. Keep doing what you're doing. You are a gentleman. You outclass me in every disagreement and I am humbled by that. I hope we can remain friends through all this.
And Lastly, Ken, you're not a pressure washer either. Your spelling is too good. You even spelled "noobie" right.
Tony Shelton
Environmental Consultant / Past Director
I'll start a new thread and get this out of here.
Mathew Johnson
New member
Why does everything have to be "go UAMCC :clap:" to have any value as an opinion?
LOL... Because it sounds a lot better then :clap::clap::clap:GO PWNA:clap::clap::clap::clap:.
Ken Fenner
Active member
My post was from me to you. Contractor to Contractor. I don't know you, Tony. As it stands right now, I just don't care for the things you post. You may be a great guy in person. We'll leave it at that and hope to meet at an R/T one day.
I retired from the UAMCC transition team two weeks ago.
http://www.uamcc.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1795
I retired from the UAMCC transition team two weeks ago.
http://www.uamcc.org/forum/showthread.php?t=1795
Tony Shelton
Environmental Consultant / Past Director
Ditto. I don't have any enemies that I've met, I don't think.
I'm not against the UAMCC or the work you guys have done. I'd just like to see something radically different. Maybe that's not possible.
I know you retired, Maybe it's like me with the RT, I was all over the place for a while after that. It's exhausting.